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	<title>Comments on: Dan Froomkin: Shout truth from the rooftops; passion is part of our job</title>
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	<link>http://www.niemanlab.org/2009/05/dan-froomkin-shout-truth-from-the-rooftops-passion-is-part-of-our-job/</link>
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		<title>By: mary thompson</title>
		<link>http://www.niemanlab.org/2009/05/dan-froomkin-shout-truth-from-the-rooftops-passion-is-part-of-our-job/comment-page-1/#comment-37100</link>
		<dc:creator>mary thompson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Sep 2009 18:06:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.niemanlab.org/?p=5226#comment-37100</guid>
		<description>sure. it takes passion and energy to say something meaningful and worth reading. if all we have to spout are platitudes and cliche-ridden sentences it&#039;s better to take up a blue collar job instead of the writing and reporting info-war zone as one&#039;s field of practice. 

exploring the nitty gritty inner core of this beautiful (and bootylicious) world requires a keen eye for observation of the minutest details and a sense of literary flair and creative endeavor. you have to capture that mystery of history (and for that you will have to go to the history of mystery). even if you think you have nothing to say remember it might be a knot-thing...in other words untie the know of writer&#039;s block and lose yourself in your natural birthright which is free expression of the human personality.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>sure. it takes passion and energy to say something meaningful and worth reading. if all we have to spout are platitudes and cliche-ridden sentences it&#8217;s better to take up a blue collar job instead of the writing and reporting info-war zone as one&#8217;s field of practice. </p>
<p>exploring the nitty gritty inner core of this beautiful (and bootylicious) world requires a keen eye for observation of the minutest details and a sense of literary flair and creative endeavor. you have to capture that mystery of history (and for that you will have to go to the history of mystery). even if you think you have nothing to say remember it might be a knot-thing&#8230;in other words untie the know of writer&#8217;s block and lose yourself in your natural birthright which is free expression of the human personality.</p>
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		<title>By: Susan Gronemeyer</title>
		<link>http://www.niemanlab.org/2009/05/dan-froomkin-shout-truth-from-the-rooftops-passion-is-part-of-our-job/comment-page-1/#comment-21851</link>
		<dc:creator>Susan Gronemeyer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 07 Jul 2009 19:51:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.niemanlab.org/?p=5226#comment-21851</guid>
		<description>I have completely stopped reading the Washington Post. Dan, you were the only reason that I read that newpaper and really regret not having you at my daily beck and call.  You made reading the newspaper enjoyable once again.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have completely stopped reading the Washington Post. Dan, you were the only reason that I read that newpaper and really regret not having you at my daily beck and call.  You made reading the newspaper enjoyable once again.</p>
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		<title>By: Chase</title>
		<link>http://www.niemanlab.org/2009/05/dan-froomkin-shout-truth-from-the-rooftops-passion-is-part-of-our-job/comment-page-1/#comment-21410</link>
		<dc:creator>Chase</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Jul 2009 23:21:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.niemanlab.org/?p=5226#comment-21410</guid>
		<description>Gee Dan, a reader might conclude from your piece that Wapo writers refrain from analysis in the name of objectivity.  As a long-time reader of your column and wapo and others, I don&#039;t think that&#039;s what you mean.  The problem fundamentally is that we live in an era in which journalistic integrity demanded respect for truths whose acknowledgement would alienate a large share of the readership.  The &quot;non-partisan&quot; Respected Media chose to attempt to straddle, and that required giving equal credence to views that are patently nonsense (e.g., Think Tank Town).  As the whole concept of a shared truth has continued to erode in American society, that position has become untenable.  Leaving aside the important exposure stories (e.g., Walter Reed), Wapo today is useful primarily as a guide to Safe Conventional Consensus rather than truth, and there is precious little consensus that is safe.  A second problem is that the dailies ignore or oversimplify complex issues, either because they lack the tools or the motive to treat them properly.  Examples of Big Issues on which Wapo and their peers have utterly failed include: oil, climate, debt, social insurance, securities derivatives and their ratings, the California electricity debacle, and the housing bubble.  These are the things that are really important, and journalists have chosen to cede intelligent analysis to more specialized outlets and academics.  They chose to deemphasize journalism and compete in the infotainment market, and they are losing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Gee Dan, a reader might conclude from your piece that Wapo writers refrain from analysis in the name of objectivity.  As a long-time reader of your column and wapo and others, I don&#8217;t think that&#8217;s what you mean.  The problem fundamentally is that we live in an era in which journalistic integrity demanded respect for truths whose acknowledgement would alienate a large share of the readership.  The &#8220;non-partisan&#8221; Respected Media chose to attempt to straddle, and that required giving equal credence to views that are patently nonsense (e.g., Think Tank Town).  As the whole concept of a shared truth has continued to erode in American society, that position has become untenable.  Leaving aside the important exposure stories (e.g., Walter Reed), Wapo today is useful primarily as a guide to Safe Conventional Consensus rather than truth, and there is precious little consensus that is safe.  A second problem is that the dailies ignore or oversimplify complex issues, either because they lack the tools or the motive to treat them properly.  Examples of Big Issues on which Wapo and their peers have utterly failed include: oil, climate, debt, social insurance, securities derivatives and their ratings, the California electricity debacle, and the housing bubble.  These are the things that are really important, and journalists have chosen to cede intelligent analysis to more specialized outlets and academics.  They chose to deemphasize journalism and compete in the infotainment market, and they are losing.</p>
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		<title>By: John Westcott</title>
		<link>http://www.niemanlab.org/2009/05/dan-froomkin-shout-truth-from-the-rooftops-passion-is-part-of-our-job/comment-page-1/#comment-18311</link>
		<dc:creator>John Westcott</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 07 Jun 2009 21:03:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.niemanlab.org/?p=5226#comment-18311</guid>
		<description>I couldn&#039;t agree more. Readers want to get the meaning of what&#039;s going on in the news, not just the surface facts. Journalists who do their jobs and know what they&#039;re writing about can provide this, but they are hamstrung by the need to be objective. And journalists can provide the meaning more accurately than writers who are just pushing a point of view.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I couldn&#8217;t agree more. Readers want to get the meaning of what&#8217;s going on in the news, not just the surface facts. Journalists who do their jobs and know what they&#8217;re writing about can provide this, but they are hamstrung by the need to be objective. And journalists can provide the meaning more accurately than writers who are just pushing a point of view.</p>
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		<title>By: Sara</title>
		<link>http://www.niemanlab.org/2009/05/dan-froomkin-shout-truth-from-the-rooftops-passion-is-part-of-our-job/comment-page-1/#comment-16769</link>
		<dc:creator>Sara</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 May 2009 19:59:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.niemanlab.org/?p=5226#comment-16769</guid>
		<description>I agree that objectivity is the &quot;fig leaf&quot; of journalism&#039;s claim to being unbiased and therefore somehow more credible and qualified to cover the news.

But, as a regular Washington Post reader, I feel like if anything the news media seems to be giving up regular beat reporting in favor of &quot;news analysis&quot; pieces.  I wouldn&#039;t mind seeing more &quot;here&#039;s what happened yesterday&quot; (or this morning) news in the newspaper, myself, and a little less of the &quot;here&#039;s what we think about what happened yesterday.&quot;  As a reader, I feel like I&#039;m being thrown into the story without enough context of the actual events or people who are making up the news.  To wit, how many stories did you see on the media&#039;s projections of what conservatives are going to do to try to capsize the Sotomayor nomination?  Too many, in my opinion.

Do daily newspaper writers and editors think I&#039;m getting the more nitty-gritty news elsewhere -- local free weekly newspapers, or the six o&#039;clock local news, or special-interest publications?  Because I&#039;m not, and I often feel afloat in a sea of other peoples&#039; opinions, which even if they are well-informed don&#039;t help me figure out what the real news is.  Also, given the state of who writes and edits (and owns) daily newspapers, it often gives me a sense of what overeducated white guys think the news means to them, which I can charitably call a limited perspective.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree that objectivity is the &#8220;fig leaf&#8221; of journalism&#8217;s claim to being unbiased and therefore somehow more credible and qualified to cover the news.</p>
<p>But, as a regular Washington Post reader, I feel like if anything the news media seems to be giving up regular beat reporting in favor of &#8220;news analysis&#8221; pieces.  I wouldn&#8217;t mind seeing more &#8220;here&#8217;s what happened yesterday&#8221; (or this morning) news in the newspaper, myself, and a little less of the &#8220;here&#8217;s what we think about what happened yesterday.&#8221;  As a reader, I feel like I&#8217;m being thrown into the story without enough context of the actual events or people who are making up the news.  To wit, how many stories did you see on the media&#8217;s projections of what conservatives are going to do to try to capsize the Sotomayor nomination?  Too many, in my opinion.</p>
<p>Do daily newspaper writers and editors think I&#8217;m getting the more nitty-gritty news elsewhere &#8212; local free weekly newspapers, or the six o&#8217;clock local news, or special-interest publications?  Because I&#8217;m not, and I often feel afloat in a sea of other peoples&#8217; opinions, which even if they are well-informed don&#8217;t help me figure out what the real news is.  Also, given the state of who writes and edits (and owns) daily newspapers, it often gives me a sense of what overeducated white guys think the news means to them, which I can charitably call a limited perspective.</p>
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		<title>By: Terry Steichen</title>
		<link>http://www.niemanlab.org/2009/05/dan-froomkin-shout-truth-from-the-rooftops-passion-is-part-of-our-job/comment-page-1/#comment-16630</link>
		<dc:creator>Terry Steichen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 27 May 2009 17:17:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.niemanlab.org/?p=5226#comment-16630</guid>
		<description>Dan,

As a reader of news, I find appealing the kind of news article writing you describe.  But I wonder if the general reader would agree.

You say that the public craves more analysis and context, and more judgments by the reporter - is that a gut feeling or do you have something more concrete to base that on?

Similarly, do you have tangible reasons to support your contention that the public wants reporters to advocate for basic values, and to express outrage at, among other things, torture?

I reiterate that my questions are not personal (since I have no personal problem with what you say); they go to the question of whether we have reasonably solid evidence that the general audience will agree as well.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dan,</p>
<p>As a reader of news, I find appealing the kind of news article writing you describe.  But I wonder if the general reader would agree.</p>
<p>You say that the public craves more analysis and context, and more judgments by the reporter &#8211; is that a gut feeling or do you have something more concrete to base that on?</p>
<p>Similarly, do you have tangible reasons to support your contention that the public wants reporters to advocate for basic values, and to express outrage at, among other things, torture?</p>
<p>I reiterate that my questions are not personal (since I have no personal problem with what you say); they go to the question of whether we have reasonably solid evidence that the general audience will agree as well.</p>
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		<title>By: Gina Chen</title>
		<link>http://www.niemanlab.org/2009/05/dan-froomkin-shout-truth-from-the-rooftops-passion-is-part-of-our-job/comment-page-1/#comment-16607</link>
		<dc:creator>Gina Chen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 27 May 2009 13:11:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.niemanlab.org/?p=5226#comment-16607</guid>
		<description>I couldn&#039;t agree more with your post.

Especially like this part: &quot;I would also argue that the notion that by hiding our voices we are maintaining political neutrality is a fig leaf. Much of what we do is inevitably political; choosing what we write about, who we quote, what ideas we take seriously and which we disdain and ignore.&quot;

Whenever human beings are involved, there is bias, opinion, slant. We bring our own baggage -- view of life, experiences to everything. We can&#039;t help that. We&#039;re not robots (Thankfully!) 

I think you&#039;re right that the best way to handle that is to be upfront about it, analyze -- not pretend that presenting two sides as equal that aren&#039;t equal is objectivity. Most stories have more than two sides, and often one is stronger than others. 

Presenting the unequal as equal isn&#039;t objectivity, to me, it&#039;s abandoning a journalist&#039;s role to make sense of the world for readers. And that role that&#039;s becoming increasingly important in the new media world.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I couldn&#8217;t agree more with your post.</p>
<p>Especially like this part: &#8220;I would also argue that the notion that by hiding our voices we are maintaining political neutrality is a fig leaf. Much of what we do is inevitably political; choosing what we write about, who we quote, what ideas we take seriously and which we disdain and ignore.&#8221;</p>
<p>Whenever human beings are involved, there is bias, opinion, slant. We bring our own baggage &#8212; view of life, experiences to everything. We can&#8217;t help that. We&#8217;re not robots (Thankfully!) </p>
<p>I think you&#8217;re right that the best way to handle that is to be upfront about it, analyze &#8212; not pretend that presenting two sides as equal that aren&#8217;t equal is objectivity. Most stories have more than two sides, and often one is stronger than others. </p>
<p>Presenting the unequal as equal isn&#8217;t objectivity, to me, it&#8217;s abandoning a journalist&#8217;s role to make sense of the world for readers. And that role that&#8217;s becoming increasingly important in the new media world.</p>
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